Beterbiev vs Johnson?

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SuperLight

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Artur Beterbiev did what some of us expected over the weekend, dashing Callum Johnson's hopes. The two traded knockdowns - Beterbiev with an early hook to the head, something close to an uppercut, then Johnson returned the favour with a crisp lead hand hook.

What impressed me about Beterbiev was his ability to stay cool fighting off the ropes and out of corners, riding the storm or better yet flipping positions to gain the advantage. In fact, his knockout rear hand hook came on just such an occasion, and was obviously quite the surprise for Johnson.

I really enjoyed the bout so I'm curious as to why there hasn't been much noise about it. I saw a lot of hype about an MMA fight over the weekend, even from some boxing sources.
 
Yes, indeed.

Although I suspect that I know what the answer is; nevertheless it is a good question SL.



I was pretty sure that (with so much time off) Beterbiev may catch a few from Johnson early on in the fight, particularly since he has some pop and coming forward like Callum did is pretty much the preferred way he fights.

But, what’s interesting about the KD Artur suffered at Callum’s hands (aside from Beterbiev’s remedy to it) was how freakish it was.



Note that;
.
A) Callum’s left hook slipped off of the inside of Beterbiev’s right forearm; so Artur had defended from it quite well, but Johnson’s punch deflected off of Beterbiev’s right forearm to slide onto his lower jaw!!

B) On a few occasions Beterbiev threw some beautiful right hands that started off deceptively either as different punches or straight rights seemingly set on a slightly different trajectory than what was really the case.

C) Beterbiev ended the punch with 2 short right hands in succession; where the 1st had a delayed effect that was (for Johnson) grouped with the 2nd.

D) When Callum rose to his feet after Artur’s 4th round KD, despite what was said afterwards in interviews, he didn’t want anymore.

E) When the 1st KD happened in the same round Beterbiev - contrary to some opinions - did absolutely nothing wrong; as he waited for Callum’s body/head to come back inside the ring’s ropes before he hit him. Callum’s body/head was only outside the ring’s ropes because of how Artur had treated him. Furthermore, the referee was not calling for Beterbiev to stop when Callum’s body/head was outside the ring’s ropes, he was cautioning Beterbiev not to hit him whilst in that position.​



It was as expected, a very high contact fight.

Not sure if you have seen how banged up Callum’s face was after the fight, which was only 4 rounds?


Wasn’t too pretty.

Callum seems like a nice guy, and he deserves props for taking on Beterbiev.




Cheers,

StormCentre.

:) :) :)






http://forum.ib.tv/forum/forum/boxi...-for-james-degale-on-sunday?p=10700#post10700
 
I thought Johnson made a huge tactical mistake not jumping on Beterbiev after the knock down in round 2. Beterbiev was hurt but Johnson was extremely cautious in his follow up attack.

I actually think the way the fight played out was best case scenario for Beterbiev. He won by kayo in an exciting fight. But looked a little vulnerable. That will help to get some of the top light heavyweights in the ring with him in the future.
 
oubobcat said:
I thought Johnson made a huge tactical mistake not jumping on Beterbiev after the knock down in round 2. Beterbiev was hurt but Johnson was extremely cautious in his follow up attack.

I actually think the way the fight played out was best case scenario for Beterbiev. He won by kayo in an exciting fight. But looked a little vulnerable. That will help to get some of the top light heavyweights in the ring with him in the future.
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Hmm. Not sure how many want to get in there with him, but your point re vulnerability is taken. He is frightening and has a great, great corner to guide him. His stock went way up on my interest-index.
 
Like Rigo, Pirog, Gamboa, and many others, once a fighter gets side tracked or cant fight regularly it takes a toll. AB looked like the slugger Thomas Williams Jr in there. Great fight, but it was a youth sapping war. I hope AB can return to form. Time is running out. He still has the power but his aura of invincibility has diminished . I'd put money on Gvorzdyk to beat him at this stage.....prove me wrong.
 
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Oh, it hurts. Rigondeaux was my favourite of the Cubans my coach told me to study. And Pirog was something special.
 
brownsugar1 said:
Like Rigo, Pirog, Gamboa, and many others, once a fighter gets side tracked or cant fight regularly it takes a toll. AB looked like the slugger Thomas Williams Jr in there. Great fight, but it was a youth sapping war. I hope AB can return to form. Time is running out. He still has the power but his aura of invincibility has diminished . I'd put money on Gvorzdyk to beat him at this stage.....prove me wrong.
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I would not take that bet. Gvorzdyk is superb in just about all respects.
 
Yes, (provided* Artur is given time to overcome the long layoff) I would take the bet.

Amongst the reasons; Oleksandr Gvorzdyk had a tough/close outing against Mehdi Amar earlier this year.



Beterbiev would have stopped Amar.

Gvorzdyk is very good, perhaps excellent.



But, whilst Beterbiev’s game has some vulnerabilities (particularly when he is so insistent upon KO victories); Oleksandr has both, more vulnerabilities whilst at the same time possessing less championship level stamina.

Callum Johnson was not the first person that dropped Beterbiev in a professional fight, as Page dropped him also; before Artur went on to stop him.



The point is this; when you decide to take it out of the judges hands and take another fighter out conclusively the way Beterbiev almost always does; it’s inevitable that (besides giving the fans what they want) you’re going to take more risks and possibly be more open for counters.



Note that as soon as Beterbiev was dropped by Johnson (please note my earlier comments in post #2 {point A} on the punch) his corner cleverly told him to box rather than play “Callum’s game”; which Beterbiev then did.

And, when that happened the fight ended within a round or 2.



The fight ended that quickly (despite Beterbiev getting dropped) for various reasons including the fact that even when Artur boxes (and becomes more defensively aware) he still both; delivers extraordinary power in most punches and throws a lot of them.

Given how tough/determined Callum Johnson was, the long layoff, all the episodic legal hassles, and the fact that Beterbiev himself was dropped and had to pick himself up off the canvass to win; it was an excellent performance by Artur.

It’s going to take someone that can really hold a punch well, match Beterbiev’s high punch/power rate delivery system, and also remain composed under pressure enough to understand Artur’s technique and also dissect the strategy he uses, to beat him.



Given his above-mentioned performance against Mehdi I don’t see Gvorzdyk doing it.

Not unless Beterbiev fails to get the match practice he needs and deteriorates.



Remember, with Beterbiev we are talking about a light heavyweight fighter that has campaigned successfully at world class amateur level.

Including close fights with Usyk, some of which (if memory serves me correctly) involved Beterbiev dropping counts on Usyk with body/other shots.



If Artur Beterbiev is managed/nurtured properly he can become the unified light heavyweight champion.

I have heard reports that he easily handles Alvarez in the gym and assisted to prepare him for Kovalev.

And, I know how Beterbiev dominated most other current champions/contenders (fighting and/or sparring) on the amateur circuit.



Notwithstanding the above-mentioned *caveat I see only a few guys that might trouble Beterbiev.

And they are Bivol, Gvorzdyk, and Adonis Stevenson.



Who can tell where Stevenson really is right now (given how inactive/selective he seems to be), but he does have a big left hand; so I mention him here.

Personally, I don’t think Stevenson has the durability/stamina, composure, and skills to go 12 with Beterbiev; whom will know (and has proven with Usyk) how to take that long straight left hand away from him.



Bivol is a very well balanced fluid/strong puncher, but he drops his hands way more than any slight speed advantage he may have over Beterbiev will allow him to get away with over the distance of 12 rounds. I am not sure how collected Bivol will remain under the pressure Beterbiev brings, but Bivol V Beterbiev is a sensational fight.



Given the reputation of Beterbiev and how well it is known amongst the Eastern Bloc crew; even aside from what I have said above about Gvorzdyk; I am not sure he would enter a fight with Beterbiev confidently and/or without silent fear. Usyk owned Gvorzdyk in previous camps they shared and Gvorzdyk has enormous respect for him.

Given that, and how successful/unconcerned Beterbiev has been about fighting Usyk previously, I am not sure that Gvorzdyk would be able to put aside the respect he would have for Artur enough to overcome the skill, stamina, and power deficit he has.



Cheers,

Storm.

:) :) :)
 
Beterbiev would laughter Stevenson I believe. Of course, he must avoid the left hook and Badou Jack laid out the blueprint for that. Artur has great late power and that would not bode well for Adonis who tends to fade in the late rounds. My jury is still out on Bivol mostly because I don't know enough about him.
 
StormCentre said:
Yes, (provided* Artur is given time to overcome the long layoff) I would take the bet.

Amongst the reasons; Oleksandr Gvorzdyk had a tough/close outing against Mehdi Amar earlier this year.



Beterbiev would have stopped Amar.

Gvorzdyk is very good, perhaps excellent.



But, whilst Beterbiev’s game has some vulnerabilities (particularly when he is so insistent upon KO victories); Oleksandr has both, more vulnerabilities whilst at the same time possessing less championship level stamina.

Callum Johnson was not the first person that dropped Beterbiev in a professional fight, as Page dropped him also; before Artur went on to stop him.



The point is this; when you decide to take it out of the judges hands and take another fighter out conclusively the way Beterbiev almost always does; it’s inevitable that (besides giving the fans what they want) you’re going to take more risks and possibly be more open for counters.



Note that as soon as Beterbiev was dropped by Johnson (please note my earlier comments in post #2 {point A} on the punch) his corner cleverly told him to box rather than play “Callum’s game”; which Beterbiev then did.

And, when that happened the fight ended within a round or 2.



The fight ended that quickly (despite Beterbiev getting dropped) for various reasons including the fact that even when Artur boxes (and becomes more defensively aware) he still both; delivers extraordinary power in most punches and throws a lot of them.

Given how tough/determined Callum Johnson was, the long layoff, all the episodic legal hassles, and the fact that Beterbiev himself was dropped and had to pick himself up off the canvass to win; it was an excellent performance by Artur.

It’s going to take someone that can really hold a punch well, match Beterbiev’s high punch/power rate delivery system, and also remain composed under pressure enough to understand Artur’s technique and also dissect the strategy he uses, to beat him.



Given his above-mentioned performance against Mehdi I don’t see Gvorzdyk doing it.

Not unless Beterbiev fails to get the match practice he needs and deteriorates.



Remember, with Beterbiev we are talking about a light heavyweight fighter that has campaigned successfully at world class amateur level.

Including close fights with Usyk, some of which (if memory serves me correctly) involved Beterbiev dropping counts on Usyk with body/other shots.



If Artur Beterbiev is managed/nurtured properly he can become the unified light heavyweight champion.

I have heard reports that he easily handles Alvarez in the gym and assisted to prepare him for Kovalev.

And, I know how Beterbiev dominated most other current champions/contenders (fighting and/or sparring) on the amateur circuit.



Notwithstanding the above-mentioned *caveat I see only a few guys that might trouble Beterbiev.

And they are Bivol, Gvorzdyk, and Adonis Stevenson.



Who can tell where Stevenson really is right now (given how inactive/selective he seems to be), but he does have a big left hand; so I mention him here.

Personally, I don’t think Stevenson has the durability/stamina, composure, and skills to go 12 with Beterbiev; whom will know (and has proven with Usyk) how to take that long straight left hand away from him.



Bivol is a very well balanced fluid/strong puncher, but he drops his hands way more than any slight speed advantage he may have over Beterbiev will allow him to get away with over the distance of 12 rounds. I am not sure how collected Bivol will remain under the pressure Beterbiev brings, but Bivol V Beterbiev is a sensational fight.



Given the reputation of Beterbiev and how well it is known amongst the Eastern Bloc crew; even aside from what I have said above about Gvorzdyk; I am not sure he would enter a fight with Beterbiev confidently and/or without silent fear. Usyk owned Gvorzdyk in previous camps they shared and Gvorzdyk has enormous respect for him.

Given that, and how successful/unconcerned Beterbiev has been about fighting Usyk previously, I am not sure that Gvorzdyk would be able to put aside the respect he would have for Artur enough to overcome the skill, stamina, and power deficit he has.



Cheers,

Storm.

:) :) :)
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Ok my friend, it's on.... ..we can come to terms if they ever fight. Until that time comes I wish Beterbiev nothing but the best.
 
Oh, I wasn’t really/personally calling you out on a bet.

More saying that I would bet on Beterbiev.

I guess we can still have a friendly punt if you like when the time comes.



Anyway, how you been BS?




Cheers,

Storm.

:) :) :)
 
StormCentre said:
Yes, (provided* Artur is given time to overcome the long layoff) I would take the bet.

Amongst the reasons; Oleksandr Gvorzdyk had a tough/close outing against Mehdi Amar earlier this year.



Beterbiev would have stopped Amar.

Gvorzdyk is very good, perhaps excellent.



But, whilst Beterbiev’s game has some vulnerabilities (particularly when he is so insistent upon KO victories); Oleksandr has both, more vulnerabilities whilst at the same time possessing less championship level stamina.

Callum Johnson was not the first person that dropped Beterbiev in a professional fight, as Page dropped him also; before Artur went on to stop him.



The point is this; when you decide to take it out of the judges hands and take another fighter out conclusively the way Beterbiev almost always does; it’s inevitable that (besides giving the fans what they want) you’re going to take more risks and possibly be more open for counters.



Note that as soon as Beterbiev was dropped by Johnson (please note my earlier comments in post #2 {point A} on the punch) his corner cleverly told him to box rather than play “Callum’s game”; which Beterbiev then did.

And, when that happened the fight ended within a round or 2.



The fight ended that quickly (despite Beterbiev getting dropped) for various reasons including the fact that even when Artur boxes (and becomes more defensively aware) he still both; delivers extraordinary power in most punches and throws a lot of them.

Given how tough/determined Callum Johnson was, the long layoff, all the episodic legal hassles, and the fact that Beterbiev himself was dropped and had to pick himself up off the canvass to win; it was an excellent performance by Artur.

It’s going to take someone that can really hold a punch well, match Beterbiev’s high punch/power rate delivery system, and also remain composed under pressure enough to understand Artur’s technique and also dissect the strategy he uses, to beat him.



Given his above-mentioned performance against Mehdi I don’t see Gvorzdyk doing it.

Not unless Beterbiev fails to get the match practice he needs and deteriorates.



Remember, with Beterbiev we are talking about a light heavyweight fighter that has campaigned successfully at world class amateur level.

Including close fights with Usyk, some of which (if memory serves me correctly) involved Beterbiev dropping counts on Usyk with body/other shots.



If Artur Beterbiev is managed/nurtured properly he can become the unified light heavyweight champion.

I have heard reports that he easily handles Alvarez in the gym and assisted to prepare him for Kovalev.

And, I know how Beterbiev dominated most other current champions/contenders (fighting and/or sparring) on the amateur circuit.



Notwithstanding the above-mentioned *caveat I see only a few guys that might trouble Beterbiev.

And they are Bivol, Gvorzdyk, and Adonis Stevenson.



Who can tell where Stevenson really is right now (given how inactive/selective he seems to be), but he does have a big left hand; so I mention him here.

Personally, I don’t think Stevenson has the durability/stamina, composure, and skills to go 12 with Beterbiev; whom will know (and has proven with Usyk) how to take that long straight left hand away from him.



Bivol is a very well balanced fluid/strong puncher, but he drops his hands way more than any slight speed advantage he may have over Beterbiev will allow him to get away with over the distance of 12 rounds. I am not sure how collected Bivol will remain under the pressure Beterbiev brings, but Bivol V Beterbiev is a sensational fight.



Given the reputation of Beterbiev and how well it is known amongst the Eastern Bloc crew; even aside from what I have said above about Gvorzdyk; I am not sure he would enter a fight with Beterbiev confidently and/or without silent fear. Usyk owned Gvorzdyk in previous camps they shared and Gvorzdyk has enormous respect for him.

Given that, and how successful/unconcerned Beterbiev has been about fighting Usyk previously, I am not sure that Gvorzdyk would be able to put aside the respect he would have for Artur enough to overcome the skill, stamina, and power deficit he has.



Cheers,

Storm.

:) :) :)
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Interesting you bring up Usyk. I keep thinking if Beterbiev lays into the blini (or Usyk lays off the varenyky) then that would be an awesome match-up. In fact I think the templates for both: their respective styles and that dream fight as pros was set in their amateur meetings.

I've seen their London Olympic quarter-final and the AIBA Worlds bout the previous year. I'll say up-front Usyk's dancing, bouncing, and hyper-active Bloc lead hand work is more my thing, and he has become more refined in pretty much every respect since then. Beterbiev, however, was already back then showing some amazing form. A case of doing more than meets the eye, in terms of ring generalship, pressure that's more stalking Hagler-style than in-your-face Fenech-style, and weathering some solid shots to repay in kind. Further, while Beterbiev has a reputation for thudding power, his uppercuts are mighty sharp and precise. He landed some awesome clean ones on Usyk in the amateur bouts.
 
Yes, both Usyk and Beterbiev are pretty good.

Usyk’s employment of constant movement and a meaningful strategy that observably goes beyond the typical heavyweight tactics, makes him special.

If Oleksandr fits into the heavyweight picture well and the extra weight doesn’t slow him down, he should be a force to reckon with there.

As, his skills (and potential to improve) are far better than any current heavyweight at the moment.



As far as a reasonably immediate Uysk V Beterbiev fight is concerned; I suspect Oleksandr is probably too big/heavy now for the matchup to be fair.

That said, Artur could probably put the additional weight on without too much trouble if he wanted.



But, and this is just me, I have always thought the move from light heavyweight to cruiserweight (and/or from cruiserweight to heavyweight; Oleksandr) involves a little more than simply adding weight.

To make an immediate Uysk V Beterbiev fight; Beterbiev might be at a disadvantage unless he makes Uysk come down in weight.



That said, Oleksandr seems to have the height and reach to make the transition to heavyweight.

I expect him to outclass Bellew.



Back to Beterbiev; take a look at how he threw some of his right hands in the last few rounds of his last fight, and also some of the fights before.

He has some really powerful and sneaky moves.




Cheers,

StormCentre.

:) :) :)
 
Good comments however Usyk and AB couldn't be futher apart weightwise. I think Usyk gives Anthony Joshua an old fashioned boxing lesson if they meet up within the next 2 years.
 
brownsugar1 said:
Good comments however Usyk and AB couldn't be futher apart weightwise. I think Usyk gives Anthony Joshua an old fashioned boxing lesson if they meet up within the next 2 years.
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Sure, I was being a bit cheeky with the weight gain/loss part. Just wishful thinking because I like both fighters and think it would make another good bout.

I share your sentiments regarding Usyk vs AJ. Likewise I think he takes Bellew pretty handily. Now assuming Usyk should make that leap, what current heavyweight can take him? I'd love to see him move up, and bring back that topknot.
 
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